Welcome to Other People's Perspective, a place for you to listen, learn, laugh, and always feel better at the end of every episode, taking something bigger away from it for you and others. And now, here's your host, Freddy Cocek

Welcome back, everyone, to Other People's Perspective. I'm your host, Freddy Cocek Today, my guest is a gentleman, an associate friend of mine, a gentleman by the name of Taylor, is it Symmank I didn't want to totally butcher the pronunciation, but I've known you for like two years. I guess I should have asked a little better before now and be like, Hey, am I, if I say Samank, is that right? Or am I pronouncing it wrong? People see my last name and it gets, dude, it gets hacked to pieces. Sometimes you can only imagine if you look at my name and don't know how to pronounce it, you can only imagine some of the stuff I've been called. So how are you doing? I'm doing good, man. You? That's good. I'm doing well. I'm doing very well. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. How's the world treating you?

Freddy Cocek

It's going good, man. Busy. Obviously, New Year starts out. It's always fresh in our industry, which is good. Stay busy, which I like. It's a good time. I like being in it. I like fresh, kind of a clean slate, fresh start. It's in sports, which I grew up playing and had some played a little bit there too. It was always our thing was like rent was due every day, but we use it every year. Like every season is new. Like so clean slate, like what you did last does not matter this year. So it's kind of like that for me, it's like that mindset against it. All right, cool. Like what can we do this year? What can we separate from how we did last year? All that kind of fun stuff. So it's always, it's always fresh for me, which is good.

Taylor Symmank

I like it. Yeah. Uh, from what I understand, I mean, you, you got a, you got a pretty healthy background in sports. I'm from, you know, I'm sure, you know, junior high, high school, college up into the, up into the pros and in the NFL and, and, uh, uh, pretty, pretty good little stamp, good little stretch and, and, uh, the sports world.

Yeah, no, it was, it was a lot of fun, man. It was. As a kid, I mean, and to make a long story short, my grandfather kind of was, I wouldn't say a spearhead of that. We all ended up playing, but my grandfather was involved in sports. He coached with the Cowboys back in the day with Tom Landry, one of the Super Bowls. He's in the coach's Hall of Fame, all that kind of stuff. So that was kind of like the environment I grew up in. And then obviously like Hall of Famers from the Cowboys that we would know, things like that. As a kid, my, obviously my dream was like, Oh, that's, that's cool. I love that. Like, and all of our cousins played and I was one of the younger ones of the cousins. And so it's like, I see them play and then we play and we put, obviously, you know, Thanksgiving was always the football game, Christmas, get together. There was some American heck. Yeah. Yeah. Right. So that was kind of the environment. And so as a kid, it kind of like, kind of created some of that. And then as at a young age, I was about, I probably, I actually saw the paper, 12 years old, wrote down, it's like, my goal was to play in the NFL. And at the time I was like, played soccer, I played sports, played a bunch of different things. My grandfather was, he's known for like becoming the perfect star, which is similar to the Cowboys, right? But like the whole point was being multidimensional as an athlete. And then that helps you perform better in your position. And so he made me try a lot of different things. I did dance, I did a bunch of just random things as a kid, which was dance was for coordination, dance was for rhythm, like all the different things. He was very sport science minded. So that was the fun part of what I got to do. And thankfully, because of that environment, I got to go play D1, go play in the NFL, and all these different things. So as a kid, going back to that story, I wrote down I wanted to play in the NFL. And I was like, if I have to, I'll kick. I wrote that down because I always played soccer, and I was good at it naturally, thankfully. But I never wanted to be a kicker. I thought they were soft. I thought they were like, just like the guy that just you don't want to be friends with, but they're out of shape. They were, I was like, man, you're soft and you're good. Like, I don't want to be that. Like, you know, I'm just like, I'm not about it. And so I was like, I'll just do it because I can. And it gives me, you know, as a kid, I'm like, I get to be on the field more. Why not, you know, score a touchdown, kick a field goal, get seven points instead of six. Why not? And then as I got older, it kind of became like, I was like, okay, cool. Like I'm, I'm actually, I'm getting better at this. I mean, I was, I did not grow the way I wanted to until I got to college. So it was, you know, in high school playing receiver at five, five, 10, you know, about one 50, like soaking wet. Um, obviously I'm white. I wasn't fast at the time. It was like four or seven. That is not recruitable D one. I'm like, I'm missing the boat here for a second. I was like, I know I can do it. And I had good stats and I was a leading receiver or whatnot, but I was like, that's not D1 recruitable, especially now. It was like, you gotta be like four, three, four, four, six, five, whatever. So at the time I was like, okay, cool. I got to figure out what I'm gonna do. And funny enough, in college, I get to be, I grow to six, three, four, five, six, five. I'm about right under 200 pounds and run a four, four on pro day. I'm like, I could use this in high school. Where was this a couple of years ago, like two or three years ago? Yeah. I've been doing great, but I already had late bloomer. Yeah, truly. So I already think the kicking and punting route to my goal from there is already kind of determined what I want to do. And the first goal I went to, they didn't let me do both. So I had to make that decision pretty quickly. The first goal I went to is D2. And I went there to try to play all. They let me. we'll recruit you as receiver or kicker." I was like, oh, sick, someone's gonna let me do it. I get there, they're like, no, we can't. If you get hurt as receiver, we lose like four different positions, because you did kickoffs, punts, field goals, and then you play receiver, we don't have anybody else. I'm like, well, that kind of makes sense, but as a high schooler, I was like, Paul didn't let me do what I wanted to do. Didn't believe in looking skin, right? So after that, I transferred out and went to tech, spent some time out there, and then played my four years there, and then went on to a couple of teams in the NFL. That was kind of like my in a in a synopsis, but was a lot of fun. I loved it. And let me be who I mean, at that point to make a full circle of like the athlete side of things, my goal, because I wasn't going to be a receiver and I had to like get street cred in my mind was like, I got to be the most athletic kicker in part of the country, which thankfully they at that time, I started having like little things where you could be like nominated as kind of that kind of thing. Um, so, you know, working out, so I'd always like, I'd race the receivers in forties. I would like out, like, I just do all that. I think it's true. Like, I'm not just going to overcome this mindset in my head, which was versatile guys. Come on. I'm an athlete. Put me in an ATF chart, not a KP. But but yeah, so long story short, that's kind of how it happened. And like I said, for about four years, NFL and then got hurt, had to transition out in the business. But yeah, it was it was fun. I loved it. I miss it.

So, yeah, I could I could see, you know, I never I never got that deep into sports, not by any means, but I can see how, you know, it If you if you had the opportunity if you if you built and developed yourself up to that level and to that standard, and you know you you you functioned on that on that level, you got into that you know got into those positions and got to do that for that period of time and then you know if you. It sucks to have an injury or a situation that kind of forces you out of it, not because you wanted to, but because you probably more or less had to. I could see how that would, you know, you would definitely miss it. I guess at least you'd miss it if you enjoyed it. But if you were doing it to that level and to that extent, then obviously you were enjoying it. that's pretty awesome. That's pretty legit. And you, it sounds like you had a hell of a forefront, you know, to, to, uh, to start, start all that out with, and definitely had, uh, you had some, uh, you had a great level of, of, uh, not necessarily expectation, but if you had, you know, if your grandfather, you know, being, being in that position and, and having been exposed to all that stuff from the time you were a kid all the way up through, and, and yeah, that, that definitely, that, It gives you something to shoot for. So that's pretty awesome. I didn't know your grandfather was involved in all that. That's awesome.

Yeah, no, it's funny because he's actually the one that kind of helped me transition because I didn't know how to punt in high school, like it's not what I did, I just mainly kicked. But the first squad I went to, they're like, hey, we're recruiting you, we need you to learn how to punt. And so I had to learn. And I said my grandfather was a sports science guy, so like, He was big into like slow, like the slow-mo videos, like super slow, where like you could like dissect everything. I'd spend like 30 minutes analyzing one kick, like that kind of slow, right? And so like understanding the body, how it moves, how to get more power. So I got to understand it from a different level, which I was very grateful for, because it taught me how to watch film. It taught me how to view things, taught me how to do all that stuff. And it was cool because he, I got to be really close with him, which was awesome because he had a lot of knowledge that, you know, if I didn't, you know, spend time tapping into, I could have missed out on. Right. And so it gave me a lot of cool stuff. He, and it makes it even more meaningful now because about what's this 2024. So two years ago, I guess now, two years ago, he passed away. And I was like, when you're, when you realize like, dang, like, like I cherish those times. Like we would go on the weekend and we do, He was probably 78 at the time. We would go do yoga together. We did this and just little things like that. He would make the protein shakes. He was a sports science guy, so he'd make protein shakes that tasted terrible, but it was all the healthy stuff in it. It was just that kind of you know, like extra dad, right, if that makes sense. And so it was those kind of things looking back are like, those are like the best times, like, before I even got to the NFL, before I was going into college, I'm like, those were freaking awesome moments. We'd spend, you know, three hours at the, you know, the fields practicing and all that kind of stuff. And but yeah, no, it was, it's cool to look back on and see all those things. As a kid or in the moment, you don't realize like the dots connecting, right? It's a lot easier now to be like, oh dang, like that's cool how that connects. And I wasn't thinking as a kid, like, oh, my grandfather does this. I need this help. I'm just like, oh, I'm just, he says, get out of the bar. I gotta get out of the bar. Like we're doing squats. That's where I was at, right? So it's just like one of those things. So it's cool to look back on is my point and kind of see and how the pieces align and, the time setting that I had. Right. And so as a kid, my goal, once he started, cause he was very, I mean, very much, he was 77, had a six pack. He on this thing called the masters, which is like track and field, but mainly field events, um, that he would compete at. He won multiple gold medals in for like the disc throw the hammer. Like he was very much into like the sport science himself too. So like, My thing was wanting to him to once we're getting the college stuff to him, build a watch and see me play a pro game because that was always the goal. He actually was a coach. He was going to be a player first before he started coaching for the Giants. And. He had a kid and he couldn't, which was not my my mom, but her sister. And so he didn't go play. And so he's never going to be a player, but he had to be a coach in Hall of Fame. And so my thing is, I want to complete the cycle of like being a player. And so it's cool to spend some time with the Giants and other different teams. And so, yeah, long winded, but just it was just cool thing looking back on and how it all works out. You know, you don't know when you're in it, but it just to to to that point.

You know, I think back, you know, oftentimes I think about, you know, experiences I had when I was a kid, you know, my, my, my, well, out of my two grandfathers, you know, my dad's side, my mom's side, my grandfather on my dad's side, he passed away, you know, before I was ever born. So, and this was like in, you know, I was born in 80 and I believe he passed in like 1964. So this was like a long time back. You know, when I talk to people or hear them, you know, recapping on, you know, opportunities that they had to, you know, experience those things with family, whether it's, you know, with grandparents or with, you know, parents or other family or, you know, family, friends, close, close family, friends, whatever, you know, the just like you said, you know, when we're kids, we don't we don't fully realize the significance of a lot of that stuff when we're younger, but then as you get older, you really start to realize, and I guess reflect back on things. Part of it is, it's great to have, when we lose someone, any Any memory or any opportunity we have to kind of remember them or honor them is is it's good to have that in your in your memory bank. But man, if you've got like a whole flood of memories and opportunities that you had to, you know, to spend with him or anybody that's that's significant, you know, when when somebody's got that, man, that's that's that's awesome. And. I, I, uh, I admire that. I respect that and appreciate that for you. And I admire that the fact that you had those opportunities, you know, it's like, I look back, I'm like, man, I, you know, my dad passed away when, uh, uh, this back in 2002. So it's been over 20 years since my dad passed. So, you know, from the time I got out of high school, uh, you know, all the way up through, through all of my working career up until now, you know, I, I, I still have my mom, but I haven't had, you know, my, my dad to, to share experiences and opportunities with. And, and, you know, it's like, uh, it's like a lot of lost history when you, when, uh, when a person doesn't have, you know, any of that stuff to kind of reflect back on. So I think that's, you know, and I, I hate to hear that you're, you know, you said you lost your grandfather a couple of years ago. Yeah, two years ago. I hate to hear that. I'm sorry to hear that. But, you know, that's awesome that he took the time, you know, to spend and invest with you when you were younger, whether it was, you know, junior high, high school or up into your college career and all that, not only for himself, but, you know, as much to benefit you and your family, you know, going forward, you know, passing on that knowledge and experience to, you know, to keep it going. So that's awesome.

Yeah, I appreciate that. Yeah, it is. It's cool to look back on. I'm just thankful for, you know, you sit there and you're thankful for the time you have, right? That's the cool part.

Yeah, like we were both saying earlier, when you're young, you don't think about it as much. The significance of some things doesn't stand out as much whenever you're younger. But then as we get older, a lot of that stuff, and sometimes it depends on where we're at at a given time in our lives or what we've got going on and what's happening. you know, the significance of those things really starts to become significant and has a lot more meaning when you can remember it and especially when you can take experiences that you've had and apply them to your own situations or at least take that information or the, you know, the information from some experience or some opportunity and either use it for yourself or at least to be able to, you know, to kind of parlay it and pass it on to somebody else for their benefit. You know, that's become like a, that's become a huge thing, you know, to me and for me is to try and That's kind of where I'm at, or part of where I'm at anyways, like right now in my own journey, in my own life, it's like, I came out from where I've been in a business setting for over 13 years. And I had another 10 plus years of business experience before that, before I started my own business, before I, with a partner, you know, started a business, you know, I worked for other companies and other people for, you know, 10 plus years before that. And so, you know, I'm kind of at that point in my life where anybody I feel like, you know, within reason should always be trying to, you know, pass on some knowledge, you know, from what they've done or what they've experienced, what they've learned. They should always be trying to, you know, I guess for lack of a better term, kind of pay it forward or at least, you know, pass some stuff on to someone else that's, that's useful and beneficial. But I feel like that's a, that's like a really big thing that I want to try to focus on now. And I'm, I'm still, still trying to figure out where I'm going to fall and everything. And like how I'm going to, how I can, uh, go about doing something bigger, uh, in that, in that respect or in that capacity, but it's, it's going to come it's, it's, uh, if nothing else, just the, just the, the people that I've met and encountered in the last couple of years. And, you know, the, the mindset that a vast majority of, like the Apex group, a vast majority of everybody's mindset or frame of mind is thinking on a higher level and wanting to grow themselves, but also in that process, trying to help others, trying to grow themselves by helping others grow, at least in some senses of the word.

Yeah, no, absolutely. And that's, that's the best part about it. Right. And that's, that's cool. Cause obviously that's how we got to meet, right. And being around environments like that. And that's kind of the one thing I always talk about now with even just ex-sports guys. And then also to just guys in business now, it's just like the, I didn't realize it, like this was probably a year or two ago now, like one of the biggest like revelations I had from sports to business now. Cause at first it was like, I was sitting there for the first year. I was like, this is awful. Like you do something for what 20 or not 20 years. Well, let's just say your whole childhood up to 25, 27 years old. And that's the only thing you knew. And it's like, hey, like you're done. Figure something out. I'm like, well, I don't know what that is. Can I do anything? So it was really one of those things where I was like, I don't know which way to go. I don't know what to do. But the one theme throughout sports I learned is it helped me create what it was. Because I look back, I was like, what made me successful? The top, whatever percentage it is now to play in the NFL. will allow me to do that. And then I looked at it like sports created the infrastructure for it. But I didn't know like I was able to create like pinpoint what that was outside of the business until I got around to people and saw how it worked. But basically, sports was like They create the team for you, right? They create the staff for you. They create, like, basically your board of directors. They have the training staff for you. They have all the different pillars and pieces in place that you need. And then, you know, you get the coach on the side that helps personal training. You do, you know, the weightlifting coach or whatever it may be. Like, you start bringing in this, and it makes sense when you're playing sports, right? Like it does. Like, that's what I need to do next, or that's what someone's telling me to do. And you do it, then you, I realize, you look back, like, oh, cool. Like, I was able to be, you know, the best in the world at this. And why? And then I get out and I'm trying to figure out like, how do I be the best in the world at something else now? And I'm like, yeah, well, here's the blueprint essentially of what was supposed to happen. I need to get, you know, people around me, like you hear all the time, it's like, you're the CEO of your life, right? Like, so I was like, okay, cool. If I'm going to operate that way, how do I create that? Whether I have a business or I don't, like, can I need, you know, good people around me, number one, because that's going to be my board of directors, right? Or however you want to use the terms. I'm going to need a team around me. It could be friends, family to help keep me on the right path or like to speak life into certain areas or to say, don't do that. You're an idiot. Whatever it may be. It's the funniest thing. I'll put it here. It's like as a kid, you grow up like you grow up and you're like, you look at that coach that's, you know, maybe not in the best shape. You're like, you never played. You don't understand. Like, that's how you view as a kid. Right. And you're like, you don't even understand. Like, you can't even you can't even do what you're asking me to do. But you don't understand why that's important still, that role that they're in. And then you get old and you're like, well, they saw something or they could see something I can't see. And that's helpful. It's not like that they can do what I'm doing. That's not what I'm asking them to do. I'm asking them to see something I'm not seeing. And then so like, and everywhere I've laughed, I'm like, okay, I gotta get people around me. They don't have to be able to do what I'm doing necessarily, but they can see something I'm not seeing so that I can perform better. Like that's their particular role, if you will. And so that's where I like in life, I'm trying to like imitate that whole like infrastructure of like a cool team of people that help me here. When I'm hurt, I need somebody to help me there. Just like staff, like a training staff would, or, you know, equipment staff, you need that. Like there's all the different pieces you put into place. And then ultimately, those all come together and formulate, you know, a winning environment or atmosphere or whatever you want to call it. So like, that was one of the biggest things, like, I was like, Oh, like, like, I'm looking back, like, that's what it takes. And then you go into now being in business, I'm like, It's very important, not only for the individual, but for the business the same way. You need elements in the business too. And I was like, dang, it just streamlines all of myself through it. And I'm just like, it's cool to look back. Like I said, it's so weird to look back on and see all the different lessons. Because like I said, when I got done, I was like, I don't, I don't have any skills. I don't have anything to offer. Like I played sports on a field, like my body, like that's what I did. I didn't, you know, I didn't have anything else that I could go into the corporate world or whatever world with. Um, and then it took some time, like, okay, there's a lot of connections that help build. And like that being one, like, I know how it works and how to be successful at something. Now it's going to pair them together. Um, so I always talk about that and bring it up too, because even if you didn't play sports, if you're in business, you come from a different industry or a different career path. you go to another one, you didn't forget all the skills that you developed. You didn't forget all the things that made you good at what you did before. You just transition them or find the connecting points that actually separate you from everybody else you just stepped into industry with because they don't understand what you know. The industry you may come from, the industry you're going to doesn't actually do it, which means that you have a blue ocean now because you're used to doing it and you can create and be the first one. There's a lot of things that When you first get into it, you don't think about, right? It's like, ah, I'm just the new guy at the bottom, you know? And sometimes it feels that way, but your knowledge and things you learn doesn't necessarily put you there. It's how you think about yourself being there, right?

Absolutely. you might come from one space or one environment into another. And if you're thinking, well, nothing that I carried over from over here applies to here. But still, there was a set of character traits and skills and characteristics that it took you to develop yourself to get to this point in this space. So a lot of those character traits, qualities, skill sets that you use to develop yourself to this person at this point, like you say, a lot of that stuff carries over or transitions. You just have to either find the connecting points or, hey, you might all of a sudden you're in the blue ocean. It's like you feel like you're in this weird space, hey, some characteristic about you in this new foreign space that you're in might be, you know, that might be like the, the hook, you know, that might be it. That might be like the new thing that, you know, you can bring something to the table there that's never been brought before. You know, you never know. Exactly.

Exactly. One hundred percent. No, that's that's that's the cool part about it. And that's the part I always like to I look back on, I think on no matter what I'm doing or industry that I'm in. And and yeah, so that's just Cause at first it took me, like I said, it took me a year to figure that out. It wasn't like I just figured it out. It took me a while to connect the dots. And so like anytime I, you know, talk about it, I always mention it because I know there's probably somebody that ever thinks about it or whatever it may be and be like, well, I'll save you a year. Yeah.

It's a, for, for any, for anybody that might ever be in that similar position, it's, it's a, the, the opportunities there, just, just because you, you, you transition and I'm even, you know, I'm in, in my own way, I'm kind of in that, in that spot mentally and psychologically with, with where I'm at in life right now, because I've been in, you know, I primarily in, in the, you know, in the oil field or the oil and gas industry for, you know, it's been, over 24 years now, collectively, between the times prior to having my own business, working for other people, all the way through that, and the things that I've been exposed to and experienced in the last couple of years, people I've met, and people that I continue to talk to and meet now, and Having realized some time back that there is definitely opportunity in many, many forms all around us and in all these different capacities, you just have to, if you operate with an opportunistic mindset, you got to learn how to know, how to kind of, you know, either either dial in or get dialed in or focus on on one particular opportunity, or you'll if you're if you're an opportunist, or you have an opportunistic mindset, you'll have this, you know, the shiny object deal, you'd be looking around at every thing and can't make a decision. But I'm like in that spot where, you know, I've been in, I've been kind of like you were saying earlier, it's like you went from, you know, when you were a kid all the way up until you're, you're, you know, professional athlete and NFL. And then all of a sudden, when you're out of that and there, you have to be out of that and you got to move on to something else. Like, well, shit, that's all I know is, you know, from way back here up until now, this is all I know and all I've done, but, and I'm kind of in that same spot. Cause I, I've done what I've done or been in the space I've been in for the period of time that I have that I'm like, well, shit, what am I going to do? Like, if I have to do something different outside of here, like, how's that work? How's it, how's it going to, you know, it's kind of scary almost like it's been, you know, I've had some like moments of apprehension where I'm like, Am I going to do this? I can't do anything else outside of here. But you completely and totally can. You can take the skills that you learned and applied, doing what you were doing prior. And as you said, you know, you kind of find the connecting points or you figure out how to integrate some of those skills and some of that knowledge and experience, integrate it into, you know, something different going forward or kind of mold it to fit into, you know, something else or at least apply it to where You know, at first glance, you might think that, well, shit, you know, none of this, none of this is going to work in anything else, but. Inevitably it almost always does. So it's gotta, you just, you can't, you can't, uh, you can't talk yourself out of it mentally and say, well, there's no way I can do that, you know, because there's just, I can't, I can't take what I learned over here and use it over there. It's not going to work, but yes, it will. You just gotta. You just got to get your, get your, uh, get your head in the right place about it. And, um, and be, be willing to, you know, to be, to be persistent and pursue it and, and find, find where you fit.

100%.

So how, uh, um, How did you, how'd you go about falling into, to where you're at now after you, after you transitioned out from, uh, from, uh, the NFL from sports?

Yeah. So, um, basically once I, I finished up the, um, kind of worked out at the very beginning of it. So first thing I thought to do was, okay, cool. I need to get around the same way I'd lock and walk into any other locker room. I went to a team does with like, okay, who's the hall of famers or soon to be hall of famers probably is how it would be. or pro bowlers or, you know, all that kind of stuff. And I wanted to get around them because obviously they're doing some successful. And especially in that team frame, like they were, they understood the staff, so it worked. If you do what they're doing, you'd probably get the same result, that whole thing. So I had to try to apply that to business. So I was like, okay, who do I know is successful in business? Was like the first question I asked. And there was one guy that I grew up with kind of a, childhood, like friend, family mentor type person who's a high executive level at a big commercial type company. And they're a fortune, I don't know, 500 or a thousand company or whatever it was. And so I was like, I just want to get in the room. I just want to sit in a business meeting, like with your team, with your staff. I don't want a job. I don't need anything. Like, I just want to sit in and see what it's about, how you operate at that level. And if I even like it, like what it looks like. And so went to the meeting. That's awesome. The first the first place I went to, and thankfully he let me in. Right. Like every lot of people say no, but thankfully he was like, hey, come on. I'm just sitting in the meeting to see how we how I do business. Really was what I wanted to be that fly on the wall over there. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So I got to see how he ran the meeting. I got to see how people back and forth and what that looked like and questions and how you like all the navigating parts of it. And then after the meeting, he pulled me into his office. He's like, hey, don't tell anybody this, but I'm actually I'm actually leaving here and I'm buying an interest.

I know. I was like, what?

I'm actually buying an insurance agency and I want you to tell me run it. And I'm like, cool, I'll hire it. Sweet. Let's make it happen. So I was like, well, do I need to do anything for insurance? Like, yeah, there's a test you have to take, you have to pass it. And in order to do all that stuff. And so I was like, okay, cool. Like, how do I take the test? And when do I need to have a test? Like, you know, be done by. So I had like a month to study for this thing and try to pass it. And before we like the time frame of everything unfolding and thankfully passed it, went into it. And then we kind of went that direction, bought a book of business, spent time on insurance first. So that was the first. And it was, I would.

This is new data to me. I had no idea about this.

Yeah, it was just, I was hesitant at first. Cause you always hear like, if you don't have sports, you're an intern. It's like, that was always the thing where I'm falling into the trap. Right. But I was like, it happens in my industry too. Really? Yeah. So it's, it's, um, it's one of those things where like what kind of got me home was like I wanted to get around like I wanted to learn from the person ultimately like that's I didn't really care about the industry I wanted to get around to be successful so I could like at least absorb some like there's a thing um I think it's Ed Milet says it like you um In life, it's more caught than taught, right? So a lot of times it's just this whole fly on the wall thing, right? It's like, you can't tell me everything I need to do enough, but I can watch you and take up 10 times as much information, right? that was what I want. It's like, I want to be able to just get in the room and kind of absorb and catch as much as possible. Um, cause he's not going to sit down with me and say, Hey, in this situation, you do this. And since we needed, like, I just watched him do it. I'm like, okay, cool. Take that like that, that. And so I needed somebody to watch essentially.

And that, that takes that not to interrupt you, but I was gonna say that takes the type of person with, with, you know, the, the mindset that you had at the time that you were willing to listen with the intention to, to retain and learn. what you, a lot of what you were hearing and kind of, you know, probably kind of sifting through and deciding what seemed, you know, more useful or more prevalent and what was, you know, yeah, you're hearing everything, but deciding on your own what what seems prominent and what's useful instead of waiting for someone to tell you or hoping that they'll tell you all the right things that you need to know. It's like, just listen and use your judgment and call it more than talk. Is that what you're saying? I like that. I've never heard that, but that definitely, that definitely makes sense. Anyways, I mean, no. Yeah.

And so that's how it was for me. I was like, I just want to get around it to where I can like get some of the information. Cause I didn't have, I had a role model. I had people I was looking to, I had people I was around in sports. It was very easy to find those for me, but I didn't have anything in business. And so I was like, I don't know where to look. Like what's standard? I didn't know it was standard. I knew like, be honorable, be right, like all the basic things, which is funny because a lot of the basic things are hard to come by. Fascinating, right? But it's just one of those things like, I'm going to learn all the tricks and hacks. And it's like, if you just be a certain way, you'll separate yourself naturally. But it's just one of those things. But you don't know that until you get into it, right? So it's one of those things that you're seeing people operate that way, you're seeing people not operate that way, and you see what happens. It's like, there's just a lot of things you learn through caught, because no one tells you that. I mean, they do, but it's just kind of more like, yeah, whatever. We'll see. Are you successful? I don't know. That kind of thing, right? So it's one of those, that was how it started for me, essentially. Once I got transitioned out, went into that, and thankfully, that's where it started. And then he ended up, we ended up selling that book of business. He was basically at retirement anyway. He was just doing it kind of as another thing to kind of before he retired. One last two raw kind of deal.

Yeah, exactly.

We bought a book that needed to be turned around. So we basically turned around and then made profit off of whatever there. But it was a lot of learning lessons for me, which was great. And I got to start there. Like I said, my whole goal was just to get around something I could watch and be like, cool, that's what someone at that level looks like, does, operates by, and I could take that with me. And that was more important than the money at the time, because I didn't necessarily need it. It's always nice. But at the same time, I was like, that stuff, I can't, later you have to pay for that to go get it, right? Like I was, I get paid a little bit and make that too. It's like a win-win for me. So thankfully that was a good decision I made then. Hindsight, like looking back, but that's how it started. Yeah. And then that kind of led me into falling into insurance route a little bit on the brokerage, another one. I kind of built my own a little bit there, operated some of that, handed it off to somebody else as I went to the Apex thing. So I started seeing what was a part of all that. I just wanted to get that same thing I found with the first guy on the insurance. I wanted to find another thing like that, like someone, and a lot of people that were operating that way, looking to grow, looking to... Because the insurance space, if anybody's familiar with it, the older you get, which is a great business model, right? Like it can be, it's a lot of residuals. It just sits there. But at the time, young age, I wasn't, I didn't want to just sit back. Like I didn't have checks to sit back and just collect, right? Like I was, I was trying to hustle. I was trying to create something. And so a lot of people I was connecting with, with insurance space were like, I mean, they'd be, you know, nothing wrong with the golf course, but they were at the golf course like six, seven hours a day. And I'm like, I'm in the hustle phase. Like you can teach me a lot there, but like, there's no, I can't, I can't win and, you know, continue to keep winning from just there. Right. And so like, it was more like lax. I wanted, someone was like, I'm hungry. I want to build, I want to grow on that kind of mindset. Um, not the routine mindset. I mean, I would love to be there. If I had the book of business, I'd be doing the same thing. But at the time in the season I was in, it was more of like, like I'm, I'm trying to create what you already have. How do I go there? I need to be surrounded by people like that. And that's what led me to the apex thing, which I'm in now. Yes. So that's how it happened.

No, no, that's, that's a, that's an awesome progression of things, man. And, and, you know, what you were talking about with, with, uh, you know, having, having a friend that, that, you know, you know, gave you or afforded you the opportunity to be able to, you know, to sit in on some stuff and have a learning opportunity like that. I'm not going to say those don't exist, but it's relatively rare. But for someone thinking along that line or thinking like, you know, to operate, you know, by your method or your thought process at the time, it was like, I just, I just want to get in the room just to, to understand the process and to learn about it. You know, it's not that you were, you know, in, in the, the earlier phases of it, you weren't in there because you're like, fuck, you know, I gotta, I gotta figure out how to, I gotta figure out how to make a million dollars out of this deal this year. You know, it was like you, you, if, if you're, if you're, you're, your mindset or your mentality about it kind of going in was, you know, I want to take this as an opportunity just to to understand the structure to learn the structure and the progression and the growth of it. I mean that's that's huge and if anyone if anyone ever has an opportunity, you know anyone that's trying to grow themselves or if they're either trying to. you know, figure out their transition from where they've been into a new space or a new area, or even if they're in whatever area they're in at a given time, if they're trying to grow in that, you know, if they can find someone or some avenue, some mechanism that will afford them that opportunity to you know, knowledge is power, man. And then, you know, and knowledge is available in so many different forms and fashions. And for anybody, you know, if they just take it upon themselves to you know, go find it or reach out there for what's the worst that they can do. You know, somebody's going to, you know, they tell, you know, what happens if they tell you, yes, when you go, Hey man, you know, I'm so-and-so I'm, I'm trying to grow my business or I'm trying to understand and learn more about, you know, what y'all do, how it's done. you know, hey, can I, of course, I mean, this was kind of a, kind of a one-off deal or a little more, a little different circumstances, if this was somebody that you had a personal connection to, but still, you know, the opportunities are out there and I implore people to, you know, do everything they can to use that kind of stuff to their benefit, you know, to, to educate themselves and to learn about processes and things that they want to learn about because the, you know, the, the opportunities there, you just gotta, you gotta go after it. And you went after it, you educated yourself, you, you, you learn more about it and that. helped you in your journey and your progression. So that's, that's legit. I like that. That's good.

100% man. And I'm thankful, obviously looking back and kind of being around people that helped me like with that. And that's obviously why I found a lot of things with Apex. I was like, okay, cool. I get to be a part of that. I get to be a part of the same version of, cause like once guys get done with playing sports, like that's kind of where they were at the same spot I was at. I was like, well, I got an opportunity to create some of the same process or pathway that I went through. and just shortchange it for them, which is fun, right? Like that's the cool part about it. It's the whole thing of like, forget who says it, but like, if you, um, what's his name, it should come to me. But basically the whole premise of it is if you help enough people, you'll best, you'll basically always be taken care of. Right. Like, and so like, that's kind of the mindset of it. And then, which ultimately always been and been true, right. There's a lot of different things from, there's a bunch of different books on that. book called a go giver that's about that too. And so it's like, there's just getting yourself in the room also helps you understand and see things that it's the whole coach analogy earlier. It's like, help me see something I didn't see before. It wasn't that I was, I'm not smart. It wasn't that I didn't, didn't understand. It's like, I just didn't know that's what I had to pay attention to. Or I didn't know that that wasn't an option on the menu. Like I could do that. And so like, once you understand, you see, like, well, I can easily do that. But sometimes you just don't know you're at the wrong restaurant. Like, you know what I mean? Like, you just got to get the different menu in your hand and someone kind of showing you what it is. And so that's been, that's been the funnest part and getting to see that. And then obviously from my perspective, getting to see everybody and their industries, what they're doing and kind of seeing like, oh, cool. That's how you do it. That's all. Okay, cool. That's how you do it. Like it's seeing a lot of different ways of how people do things. And then obviously getting to see everything always has, you know, these, these connecting pieces where it's like, okay, no matter what industry you're in, you're doing this, this, this, this, and this. And I'm like, okay, no matter what you do, do this, this, this, and this, and you'll be successful as long as you stick true to the fundamentals of that. And then obviously understand the business knowledge and all that kind of stuff that goes with the industry. But then all these five things you need to do, great. You just give it time and you'll be there. And then surround yourself with the right people and all the different things you get to do. But yeah, no, it's a game changing stuff. And I always encourage people to get, they don't understand the, I mean, it's like, We understand it. We hear it. It's like you're in, you know, you're the son of the five people that you hang around with. Like we hear that since we're kids, like the cliche thing, but like, we almost say it and believe it the same way that we say it. It's like, you know, the five something, you know, hang around, whatever. Like, but the reality is like the older you get, you're like, I'm like, that's legitimately true. Like that's, that's even more real than you realize. Um, and so it's, it's a game changer truly.

Cause you get to see what's going on at the same time. you know, another, another interesting aspect that I've, I've, uh, I've kind of picked up on or try to focus on sometimes, or at least I find, I find this interesting, you know, you're, you're talking to the, to the coach analogy earlier, like when you're, when you were a kid and you're looking at the coach going, Oh, well, he couldn't even, you know, Coach looks out at your elementary school kid, junior high kid, you know, if you're a junior high kid, probably talking smack, oh yeah, coach is fat, he couldn't even do this anyways, blah, blah, blah. You know, as we age and as we progress, experiences that we have had in our past or things that we have seen or been subjected to, you know, you could take something that you remember, an experience that you remember from your past, say from, you know, 20 years ago that happened 20 years ago in your life. You fast forward 10 years from that point and you look back at that situation and your outlook and your perspective and the things you see and remember about it are going to be X at that time. And then you fast forward another 10 years to present and you look back at it and chances are you're going to see or remember or pick up different things about it now at this point in your life, as opposed to what you did 10 years ago. Now, if you fast forward another 10 years from now, and you think back to that same situation that was now 30 years ago, it's very likely that, you know, your perception of it or, you know, the things about it that are significant to you or that stand out, it's going to be different at that point. It's the same situation that happened at whatever, you know, X point in time that many years ago. But as we get older and our perception of things changes, our perspectives change because of things that we experience and It's just like growing up, you know, like the, the, the things that when we were a kid, we didn't really find significant all of a sudden later in life. It's like, holy shit. You know, that, that was pretty, that was pretty monumental. You know, it's like our, our, as we age and progress, you know, people, you know, some people complain about getting older. Oh man, I'm falling apart and I'm going to shit and everything hurts and this and that, but it, it, uh, it, it's. To me, it's like it's the beautiful part of aging and getting older is because the way that we the way that we look at things. It's like our vision, you know, your, your, your physical vision of how you look at something, you know, has a tendency to deteriorate as you get older, but your vision of how you look at things gets better as you get older. You know, it's, it's, uh, it's kind of, uh, it's kind of, uh, it's interesting to me. It's, it's like one of the, the, the beautiful things about, uh, I don't, I don't like to say I'm getting older. I just say I'm aging gracefully. So that's better than getting older.

I like that for sure. I like that way better than usually people ask me, like, how old you? I'm like, I don't know. I stopped counting at, you know, 28. So whatever, whatever I am, you just call me 28. But I like that. I'm aging gracefully and doesn't. Yeah.

I try to, I try to use that sometimes instead of. you know, if somebody, you know, talks about you're getting older, man, I'm growing older, I'm getting older, and I'm just just aging gracefully, because, you know, it's Yeah, you know, stuff might hurt a little bit more sometimes in the mornings when you wake up, or you sometimes if you stand up too fast, and you pull a muscle, like, Yeah, wait till you're in your 40s and that stuff seems to accelerate. But I'm trying to at least get smarter and better in my vision of how I view and perceive things and how I take everything in and process it and then respond or regurgitate it. So it's cool, man. Getting older ain't so bad. So some, some people make it out to be worse than what it is, but I guess it's like a lot of other things. It's what, what's your, what's your perception of it? You know, it's, it's, it's, uh, it's all how you, how you handle it and how you feel about it.

Yeah. Perception is, is everything. And there's other things we used to live or used to say all the time. And, um, and then if I was like, your perception is reality coaches would always say, right. Yes. And that's true. I think that's true to a huge degree. It very much is from the outside. But I also think from the inside to like the perception of yourself is the reality to yourself. So like if your perception is wrong, so the reality of how you see yourself is going to be technically the wrong as well. And so that's why it's important to understand the perception of how you see yourself and also to see that correctly, because it could also jeopardize the reality of it. Right. Same. Way outward, how you do anything is how you do everything. It's like that same kind of go hand in hand as well. Right. It's just like that perception you want. Yeah. So it's just it's important, I think, to your point.

Now, you know, it behooves it behooves any person to to function and operate. with the best, most positive mindset and frame of mind that they can operate with. Because if you tell yourself you're having a bad day, you're going to have a fucking bad day, plain and simple. But if you tell yourself, that I'm not going to have a bad day and, you know, things are, you know, these perceived negatives or whatever it is that, you know, somebody might dwell on and think is bad or it's going to make it a bad day or it's going to ruin your day. If you can turn that frown upside down, so much of what we do and how we get it done is driven by how you look at it. And if you look at it as though it's going to be bad, then you're going to have a tougher time than if you have an optimistic outlook on it. It carries a lot of weight, carries a lot more weight than some people realize or that they give it credit for, in my opinion.

No, 100 percent. And I think there's a thing that Tony Robbins always says, like, if you're in your head, you're dead is number one. And the number two is like where where your energy flows like that's wrong. I forget the term now. Hold on. Hold on. where your focus goes, your energy flows. And so it goes right to the perception piece. It's like, okay, cool. If I'm going to think about all the bad things that could go wrong, all of my thought process and all my energy is going to be going there. At the same token, I could think about all the things that could go right. Now I'm not going to be naive to all the things that could go wrong. I'm going to be smarter, but at the same time, I'm not going to spend my energy and all my focus and my emotional bandwidth. holding things that may not ever be true. And I'm going to focus on this and avoid the things that could go wrong. Right. But ultimately, it all comes back down to like what you just said. It's like what I'm going to focus on. That's my choice. Right. If I sit around and try to find all the negative things that could go wrong or that are going wrong, I guarantee I'll find a long list. Oh, yeah. You'll you'll you won't have enough pen and paper to write it all down. Exactly. And then so like the choices always are every single day we think about that or we can wake up because there's plenty of things that you can be opposite for as well grateful for things that are going right things that are, you know, working out that that list can be long as well and so it's just like where are we going to spend a lot of our time at. It's the whole, like the analogy, I think it's, I don't know who came up with it, but it's like, you have like two different wolves, who are you going to feed? That's the one that's going to be bigger, right? It's like the whole idea of like, where are we going to go? And kind of what that looks like. It's just, it's true. It's vital, not only perception of it, but also to the reality of like, well, you do focus on happens. I mean, I've seen it, I've seen it a lot, actually. I mean, you see it a lot in sports, for sure, for guys that, you know, they, you know, once they get finished up with college, they don't make the pros and their focus goes back to their environment of what they're doing. You find out later that, you know, they got a lot of trouble or some end up, one of my friends end up dead and get in bad circles or go to jail. Like that's, but that's the focus thing. It's like their environment helps create focus, which ties all together. It's like, that's why I talk about environment so big is because they're helping shape like your lens of what you see, which is ultimately your focus. So like your focus can be deterred, your focus can be, you know, it can be tainted. Like it's just, it really can. And so like having people to be like, oh, no, like, let me clean that up for you. Now you can see a little bit better because this is the direction that you see is important. Because ultimately whatever filter we're looking through is our reality. Like that's just kind of is what it is. And we need people to help kind of clean it up or give us a new prescription of what actually is true. Um, so yeah, I think it's important.

100%.

Very, very much. So I agree, man. Good, uh, good, good stuff. And that's, that's, uh, that's the right outlook in my opinion. You know, I, I hope that, uh, I hope people will, uh, take it upon themselves to try and try and look at things in that capacity, in that manner, you know, don't, don't let yourself, you know, don't, don't, don't beat yourself out of, out of, uh, you know, if you talk yourself out of something mentally, you know, you might have all, you might have all the resources and all the right elements to achieve it, uh, you know, physically, financially, whatever, to, to get to whatever the goal is. But if you, like you say, if you get in your head and get in your head, you're dead. And, you know, and if you, you know, for, for, you know, lack of a much, you know, it's not, not the best term anyways, but if you mind fuck yourself out of it, then, you know, you, you, uh, you, you can, you can have lost the battle before it's ever even started for you ever even, you know, fired the first shot or, you know, through the first punch or whatever. So, yeah, very, very much, very much so, um, gratitude and positivity, man.

It is, it's, it's one of those things, right? Because you can't, you can't be grateful and fearful at the same time. You can't be grateful and angry at the same time, like chemically in our brains, we can't do simultaneously. We're either one or the other. And so it's up to you to choose what you want to have. We're automatically as human beings going to be angry and we're going to be fearful. That's going to be life. It's just what you're going to do with them, right? Because now those are going to be just automatics. You're not going to have to... focus on being angry and focus on, you know, like that, those are the things that are just going to come up. Um, and so now it's like, how do I handle those? How do I make sure? Because I mean, I know you have probably plenty of examples as do I have like so many times with things I was afraid of or fearful of on the other side of that was actually like what I needed to do. And it actually was something that was like, I'm so thankful I did, but if I were to listen to the whole, fearful thing and let that be like my whole synopsis of my scenario or my lens of all the only thing I look through, I would never have a lot of the things that I have in my life or in the things I've been able to do would never exist, because I was afraid to do it, or, and I lived in that perspective right and so it's like, countering some of those things. That's one easy way. Obviously, it's like, oh, gratitude journaling. It's important, but I think it's more of like a, it's a, it's a mindset and it's a lifestyle aspect of almost not programming, but like understanding, okay, cool. Like that from a scientific level, like people believe in like, okay, cool. I'm only about science, whatever. You show me the white papers. I'm like, okay, cool. Here's the white paper for you. It's like, you can't like you, your brain literally cannot have both at the same time. So it's up to you, ultimately, and you can choose which one those are. You're not naive. You're not saying like, oh, I'm not, I'm not just like, because one thing too, I'll say this, and then I'll kind of end with that part of it is like, in the early parts, someone's like, hey, just be positive. I'm like, yeah, I get that. But there's some times when I'm like, I am pissed and being positive doesn't help me. You know what I mean? Like, I can't even find the positive part to be at. And so I'm like, okay, then what do I do then? And so then it's like, it's not trying to find the positive. It is finding the positive in my mind that makes sense. It's like, okay, cool. What are all the things that, because there's things I can be grateful for, right? Because sometimes problems are, if you view them that way, can be things you'd be grateful for, because a lot of times on the other side of problems or solutions, and solutions pay well, right? Like just the facts. And so there's a lot of things there where if we just view it that way, then we'll never even see the good side of it, number one. But then two, it's like, okay, cool. If I can't find something, then I know I can at least be grateful for something in this room. Like, first off, I'm breathing. Cool. Let's just start there. Let's just be the basic thing. It's actually one of the things I did when I first transitioned out of sports. I went through, I wouldn't say massive depression, but it was really, really tough. And I was like, I don't know what else to do, blah, blah, blah. It was just really hard. And the first things I had to start doing, cause I was, it was plenty of long, the list was very long for the negatives of what it was and very short positives. And so like I heard this one from, it's probably on YouTube, it's probably gone viral or whatever. Like the guy talks about, it's like an army general talking about making your bed, whatever it was. I was like, cool. If that's the only thing I do today, that's positive. And I'm going to remind myself, I'm grateful that I have a bed that's made. And then I'm like alive and I'm breathing and I'm healthy. Then I'm going to start there. But what I've realized four or five, six days in a row, I could stack one more after those four or five. And then when a little bit longer, I stacked another one. I stuck. And also I look up, I'm like, dangling. Well, that's pretty good. And I hadn't really changed yet around the outside. And so then but ultimately, and that's how it works, right? It's like. Once I start changing the inside, ultimately the outside starts to change because I see it differently. And then I'm like, oh, there's all these opportunities I had no idea right in front of me, sitting at my doorstep and people I could reach out to that were just basically waiting for the thing I asked. And they're like, oh, yeah, sure. I could have asked them four months ago. They would have said the same thing. But I was in my head, which means I was acting dead, right? It's the whole thing of it's just important I hit on because that's where I was. And it's real.

You, you were in that in that position where. the, the, the bulk of your energy was, was flowing to things that you were focusing on, you know, you were focused more so on, on, you know, some negativities than positivities. And unfortunately, I've done it too, man. I I've everybody has been guilty of it in their lifetime to, you know, to some extent or to some degree. Um, and it's, uh, It's a, it's a sucky situation or a tough situation to be in, but it doesn't define any person by any means. And it's just a, it's something that if anyone ever finds himself in that position or heading that direction, you gotta, you gotta acknowledge where you're at and realize that, you know, don't, don't. Don't focus on those negativities. Realize that, you know, shift some things around and focus on the positives and be grateful for the opportunities. And it's because it's there, man. It's there.

True.

So true. Yes, sir. Well, I've enjoyed it. I've enjoyed the heck out of it. I appreciate you, man.

Yeah. I appreciate you having me on. It's always a good time to catch up with you. I love stuff like this. So yeah, man, I love it.

This, this has been good. I, uh, I hope, I hope, uh, hope things go well. If I, I'll, uh, I'll actually be up in your neck of the woods, uh, later in the week. I don't know if I'll see you or not. You may be out of pocket. If I, if I catch you, then that that's, that's awesome. And if not, then completely understandable. You got business to take care of. And if I don't, uh, if I don't catch you on this trip, then I'll see you soon.

Yeah, no, hopefully I'll catch you a little bit. I might be with all the stuff with my wife, the surgery and stuff. I might be out of pocket, but if I am, I'll make sure I come find you.

Okay. No worries. You got to take care of your household first, man. I completely respect that. It's been a pleasure and a privilege and I appreciate the time to visit with you, man. Thank you. Yeah, man. Absolutely. Anytime. Yes, sir.

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